VEMS Home Products Documentation Wiki Webstore
WikiHome ProjectPage DocsPage UnderDevelopment MembersPage SiteIndex RecentChanges Preferences
MembersPage/NanassyPeter/WishList (2006-05-20 04:44:16)

Back to MembersPage/NanassyPeter

I really think that our current BoostControl implementation is VERY hard to tune.After 40-50 WOT runs i dont have ANY idea what to do.This is TOTALLY dangerous,and also kills the engine.There is ABSOLUTELY NO FEEDBACK from the system,im really blind in the dark.I suggest a freely programmable 12X12 TPS X RPM General Porpuse Output table.This solution could also be used in other applications (N2O,injector,WaterINJ, whatever u want).

Please keep in mind that i have to manage 3 turbocharged cars,so

a loggable,nicely settable open loop BoostControl would be really nice.

034 will release soon a really powerfull firmware upgrade for its own ECUs.Because i have one in hand,im really curious,is that planned that genboard will ever have features like this.Take a look at:

http://www.motorgeek.com/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=10152

Its so simple,but very effective.With some even more goddies what we already have (scalable tables) this thing should kicks ass!!

We have had most of the features added to the 034 firmware relase for a very long time. But there is a few of them that are good and is in the pipeline. -Jörgen

All tables are fully user settable!!!

that is the key.tunability is really good with these kind of "windows",because you see whats the current status of the variable.

Vbatt Dwell miltiplier Been there all the time -Jörgen

Is that settable?I dont think so.Dwell overlap?

MAP Dwell multiplier Good one, it's in the todo list -Jörgen

MAT Ignition advance Most people will fuck up their tuning with this, but it will be added. -Jörgen

CLT Ignition advance Most people will fuck up their tuning with this, but it will be added as well. -Jörgen

Aux Ignition advance Good for a race car if you don't have time to tune it before the event. -Jörgen

Baro Ign advance (we dont have a baro map sensor) Useless except for alpha-N and 034 doesn't have a baro sensor either. -Jörgen

It has a 1 bar baro sensor.the bigger II series.Peter

MAT enrichment Always been there. -Jörgen

But not user settable.I want one that is configurable

AUX enrichment Could be useful for a very small number of cars. -Jörgen

Accel temp enrichment (we have something here ,but its just easyer) You can't do it both ways. -Jörgen

Individual cyl fuel trim Yeah, good for VERY bad intake manifolds. EXTREMELY hard to tune. -Jörgen

If people will fuck up with tuning,why start to use standalone?

Anyway,the just zero out (put 1's in the fields) these fucking up features,and problem is gone.

They also could use templates,or suggested values.

If the software is good ,there should be no problem with that.

THANKS,that was FAST! Im really interested,because i started the "clone" installation,nd on that car i want to go with that.

I found that the current RPM limiter is a bit harsh,still much better than fuelcut only,but not that nice that some stock cars already have.I do not know how they really work,but maybe together we can find out.I know that some of you are much more interested making VEMS controlling idle valves flawless and so on,but i think that BASIC ENGINE OPERATIONS,such as RPM limit,are more weighty.So i think we should find out how those Hondas,BMWs limit their RPM with such little hysteresis,and almost no jerk.

I think that they do not cut all the ignition,but just cut some cylinders ignition event ,so the engine will not lose all its power,and movement.

Please write here your comments!

I don't want to argue here, but IMHO getting the engine to idle is more like basic operation than smoothing rev limit ;-)

Sure,but i installed VEMS approx a year ago,and since then it runs smooth,without any kind of idle valve,just with opened throttle valve.And there are other type of supported idle valves (and not one!!) that works.I think its not that hard to install one of these (as i did earlier with other standalone system.Just my 2 cents.

- You're right, there are well controlled valves already, however supporting a new one is always a big plus (and a big help for every BMW owners), if not too much work. I even didn't ask the firmware team to get support for mine, just did my measurements and own development on the firmware to support my IAC valve. (Getting help and comments from others though)

Now I've got a good-working code, which finally has been merged to v30, but something is wrong now (with the merge probably), that's all. We're seeking the bug, not a big deal.

i did a little search,so this is how others do:

TEC3:

New Dual Rev Limiters with ‘Triple Smooth Technology’.. 1st step retards timing to a negative -12º degrees.. 2nd step cuts coil current in half.. 3rd step coil current and fuel are cut-off.. all three steps occurring within milliseconds!

034EFI:

A dual stage rev-limiter is implemented in Iic to provide a smoother, more accurate rev-limiter of engine speed. In addition to the standard fuel cut rpm limiter, a programmable timing retard is also used to pull power before the fuel cut is realized. Thus, the driver will begin to anticipate the fuel cut by feeling power drop off as ignition timing is pulled back. Timing values from 0 to -50 can be used to accomplish this. For more information, see the Tuning Manual.

AEM:

Soft Cut Rev Limiters

Utilizing user programmable stages, the EMS offers 5 distinct modes of rev limiter. With ignition retard, programmable partial cylinder cut of fuel and/or spark and full cut of fuel and/or spark, the combinations are limitless.

MSD:

Soft Touch Rev Control

For points and OEM Ignition systems

The Soft Touch Rev Control, PN 8728, is designed to be used on standard points ignition or inductive ignition systems. This means that the PN 8728 can be installed on engines with a GM HEI Ignition, Ford or Chrysler electronic ignition, any standard breaker points systems or even with an MSD 5 or Blaster Ignition (non-CD ignitions).

The Soft Touch Rev Control is adjusted with plug-in modules and is supplied with 6,000, 7,000 and 8,000 rpm modules. When the engine reaches your set rpm, the Soft Touch circuitry kicks in and drops the spark to certain cylinders. These cylinders are fired on the next cycle to prevent fuel from loading up in the cylinder. This limiter produces very accurate and smooth, backfire-free rev limits.

Can be used on 4, 6 or 8-cylinder engines with inductive ignitions.

http://www.teglerizer.com/fi/bem/Basics%20of%20engine%20management.htm

Most EMS systems implement a rev limiter, some allow a soft-cut where the engine selectively misfires followed by a hard-cut a little higher up where the engine simply stonewalls. Some limiters cut off all fuel at the prescribed engine speed, withholding it until you're 500 rpm below the limit. Other rev limiters cut off the spark (or injectors) of individual cylinders one after the other, progressively cutting more and more until the hard-cut limit is reached so that you can barely feel that you have reached the maximum allowable rpm. These soft limiters mean that the car can be used right to the rev limit without a worry. Normally the EMS will maintain the tacho signal consistently to ensure that it doesn’t go crazy. Often the rev limiting is coupled with a shift light that warns the driver that the rev limiter is about to operate and he should change up a gear. With batched and grouped injection systems, selective cutting of fuel can be dangerous since the fuel is not injected at the optimum time for each cylinder and it is quite possible for a cylinder to induct only a partial charge of fuel which could result in detonation and resulting damage.

ALS activation switch

The ALS activation switch schematic:

als_wsitch.JPG

Note that the ALS activation input is usually on EC18 not EC36, but otherwise the circuit is fine.

See MembersPage/GaborRacz/NewAlsLaunchAndOthers

ALS swith

Currently, on this ECM (serial Nr. 337 ?), with 1.0.30 firmware no ALS activation from EC18pin16

on the ECM are connected to where you asked. You should have asked in wiki, not phone, so you would now (after several months) know. If neither of the pins activate ALS (=> so obviously not connected to SDA, which was the traditional ALS activation input; mcp3208 inputs will be recommended in the future), the mcp3208 pins should be logged to see which is connected where so it can later be configured for ALS.

For one pin at a time, issue

commands and capture the result (in binary, not hex mode) in TerminalProgram. First when input > 3V and than input < 2V. Publish the captured files. This will reveal your EC18 connections. MegaTune should have a screen of the raw voltage readings of all the mcp3208 channels to make this easier.

ALS variables

Enabled above 1500

maxtps 40%

ign retard 40

fuel enrichment 10%

ALS activated revlimit 2000

am i missing something,is something wrong with these settings?

I checked the EC18-pin16 and it gets 0V or 4.4V ,if swith is in position 1 or 2.firmware 1.0.30

A: In the latest firmware packages, there are indicators on the lower left corner of megatune main screen, ALS switch, Launch switch and shiftcut switch, To the right you have ALS Function active, which lights up when conditions for ALS activation are met and the functions are active. //Emil

Q:Yes a saw these great features of the new firmwares,

but unfortunately i cant use them.My car runs with 5 window HALL primary trigger,so maybe i can go with 1.0.34 to check this.

Can u please tell me where can i find it?

And Emil,thanks for the instant help/support!!! :) !!

It was stuck on my laptop, here you are: http://media.vems.se/code/VemsMT1.0.34-testingonly.zip

I need another IAT calibration for my newly installed 1.0.36.

Marcell did it for my 1.0.30,because of some Windows issues i was unable to copypaste the good airdensity datas.As far as i know airden_3000_287 is what works fine for me.

Currently It reads 7-8deg less then real.