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IMPORTANT: enter the case-INsensitive alphabetic (no numbers) code AND WRITE SOME SHORT summary of changes (below) if you are saving changes. (not required for previewing changes). Wiki-spamming is not tolerated, will be removed, so it does NOT even show up in history. Spammers go away now. Visit Preferences to set your user name Summary of change: '''Questions and Answers page''' MembersPage/RubenAparici/QuestionsAndAnswers '''Lancia Delta HF integrale (8v, 16v, evo1 and evo2 versions).''' * 4 cylinder inline engine, with fire order 1,3,4,2 * displacement: 2L * turbocharged '''Introduction, main characteristics and version differences''' Weber-Marelli engine management with almost exact configuration of the Sierra Cosworth system described by Zoltan Almasi: MembersPage/ZoltanAlmasi 16v and evo1 ecus are exactly the same hardware, only firmware changes. 8v ecu functionality differs from 16v/evo1 one in: 1) 16v/evo1 support '''2 distinct MAP sensors'''. A 2,16bar (APS02/03) for lower pressure and a 3bar (APS05/01) for higher one. Aparently this sofistication was there to provide better accuracy while allowing usage in a wide range of absolute pressure. 2) 8v ecu drives low impedance injectors (IW025) in peak hold. 16v/evo1 come with high impedance ones (IW058 same as Maserati Biturbo) but seems to have the same drivers than the 8v, so it could be suitable for low impedance injectors too (practice seems to prove this). 3) 16v ecu has a pin activated for diagnose lamp. 4) 16v ecu has improved firmware with larger maps (injection are 16x16 instead of 16x13, ignition 16x10 instead of 16x8). 16v ecu also has added RAM (2Kb, probably for OBD use). 5) Thanks to better firmware 16v ecu manages the overboost solenoid in modulable duty cicle (at 17Hz), while 8v just triggers the solenoid ON/OFF. Both ecus (8v and 16v/evo1) share the same pinout except the new services provided with the 16v/evo1 that use pins unused in the 8v configuration (I am refering to ABS communication channel, Diagnose lamp and 2nd sensor). evo2 ecu is a P8 one like the Escort Cosworth, Fiat Coupe 16vT, Alfa Romeo 155 Q4, and Nuovo Delta HF HPE. evo2 ecu goes back to a single MAP sensor instalation (PRT06 with 2,5 absolute bar limit). '''evo2 ecu uses a Hall Efect sensor for camsync instead of VR.''' The enginespeed and TDC sensor: VR with 4 teeth at 90º same as used in the previous generation. This is supported in firmware 1.1.x * coiltype primary trigger configured, but * another_trigger_tooth=02 * it is recommended to fire a request for testing this triggersetup when you have ordered the ECU evo2 ecu is closed loop (8v and 16v/evo1 werent), it uses a narrowband lambda. evo2 are distributorless, they use wasted spark. '''Trigger info updated''' '''Engine RPM/TDC crank-sensor: VR type''' The '''crankshaft pulley has 4 identical teeth spaced at precisely 90°'''. The sensor sends a signal to the module whenever a tooth passes a the sensor. From this signal the module determines engine speed (RPM) and the TDC position of each piston (crankshaft position). http://www.cosworth.hu/content/vegyes/vems/crank_sensor.jpg '''THE TDC SENSOR IS 10º ADVANCED FROM REAL TDC. THE PULSE BECOMES POSITIVE AS THE TOOTH APROACHES TO THE SENSOR AND NEGATIVE WHEN IT GOES.''' (this is just the good polarity for VEMS v3.x VR input) '''Phase sensor: VR / Hall type depending on model (most are VR with same polarity as the crank sensor)''' The stock system takes the ignition sequence from a 2nd VR sensor situated at the cam (1/2 engine speed). A phase sensor, located opposite a cam having '''two teeth separated at 90°''' (camdegrees) to each other, is fitted inside the distributor. At the passing of a tooth the sensor delivers a signal to the ECU. This signal is similar to the signal supplied by an RPM/TDC sensor fitted at the crankshaft pulley. '''The phase wheel teeth are not aligned with TDC, 1st tooth signals cilinder one in combustion aproximately halfway from -10º to 90º and the second tooth (at 90º from the first as previously said) signals combustion in 3rd cilinder (2nd considering the ignition order) so 180º later of crank rotation than the 1st tooth.''' '''Polarity of Hall effect sensor (for the models that use it): +5V with teeth producing a value =< 0,4V.''' http://www.cosworth.hu/content/vegyes/vems/distr_phase_s.jpg This is the graph of the VR sensor. '''The Hall one has windows in the same positions were the VR has teeth (90 camdegrees between them)''' The signal from the distributor and the RPM/TDC sensor together enable module to identify the phase of each cylinder during crancking. '''The camsync is only used during start up, once the engine is started this sensor can be disconnected and the engine wont stop. This camsyn sensor in the evo2 (P8 ecus) is not VR but Hall Effect''' '''Other sensors:''' CTS (NTC resistor), ATS (NTC resistor), Knock Sensor (audible sensing tuned for 84mm bore with filter focusing in the 12Khz-16Khz (crosschecked with Marelli manual) ---- '''Actuators:''' Ignition module (taken from Zlotan) The ECU sends a Spark-out signal to the ignition module * by factory it's a simple distributor+coil setup, not wasted spark (except the evo2). * dwell is totally governed by the module and cannot be adjusted, unfortunatelly no more data about ignition module ** required input voltage and '''trigger edge would be important''' ---- The Fuel Injectors The ECU provides accurate control of the solenoid operated fuel injectors to discharge fuel. '''The Idle Speed Control (ISC) Valve''' This unit is regulates the engine demand for air depending on the engine temperature, engine load, or swithed on accessories. The valve, which is controlled by a variable current from the ECU, adjust the air flow into the engine. '''The valve is pwm modulated. The stock VAE solenoid is excited at 90Hz (crosschecked).''' The Boost Pressure Control Valve This solenoid valve is directly connected to the high pressure side of the turbocharger by a hose. Depending upon whether the valve is open or closed it will either "vent-off" a portion of the boost to the inlet side of the compressor (valve open) or direct it to the wastegate actuator (valve closed). '''The overboost solenoid is driven at 17Hz (crosschecked).''' ---- '''The Project''' The project is not one :-) but two. First objective is to build one unit capable to replace the stock ones (8v, 16/evo1 and evo2) just by configuring the camsyc sort of trigger (VR or Hall) and the distributor / wasted spark ignition installation in that car. A sort of plug and play option but with this added functionality: To switch between different maps + the tipycal VEMS functions (programability, datalogging, OBD, display...). Second objective is to build a racing purpose ecu being it: distributorless with COP, ALS switch, Launch control switch, injection cutoff switch (for sequential gearboxes), different maps switch + the tipycal VEMS functions (programability, datalogging, OBD, display...). Individual cilinder injection and ignition corrections would be interesting. Capability to work in close loop with 4 lambdas, or better, ion sensing would be highly interesting. ---- '''Links''' My site about integrales and engine management: http://prograle.org/ Chip Tunning a Rally car: http://www.clublancista.org/albums/view_album.php?set_albumName=album168 My Rally Car project: http://www.clublancista.org/albums/view_album.php?set_albumName=album242 Optional: Add document to category: Wiki formatting: * is Bullet list ** Bullet list subentry ... '''Bold''', ---- is horizontal ruler, <code> preformatted text... </code> See wiki editing HELP for tables and other formatting tips and tricks.