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'''LANCIA DELTA INTEGRALE HF 16V''' rallycross cars. *2L engine *4 Cyl *turbo *36-1 toothweel with VR trigger ** no camsync *wasted spark coil *4 bar MAP sensor, about 1.7 - 1.8 bar boost *permanently opened throttle body for ALS There are 2 cars here, they are almost the same, except one of them has high impedance injectors, and the other have low impedance injectors. The cars was running succesfully from a year with VEMS, and with 1.0.38 firmware, everything was OK. They use start limiter and boost control too. Now the cars came back. They need ALS. I uploaded the prereleased 1.1.7 firmware into one of them. Here are the config files: [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/config.txt config.txt] [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/tables.txt tables.txt] [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/Lancia_SZABI_04.msq lancia.msq] ALS works almost perfect, but i realised some minor problems. We need an ignition cut gauge in megatune to easy tuning, and also we should take into the log the actual ign cut. Hungarian: Szerintem 0 foktól kellene megadni a retard értékét mert ha be van kapcsolva az ALS kapcsoló és elértük az idõlimitet akkor az alapjáratot a soft ign cut limiterrel tartja a kocsi, ekkor a gyakorlatban jólmûködõ ALS beállítások mellett még mindig retardolja a gyújtást a vezérlõegység, amire semmi szükségünk nincs. Nekünk csak a negatív gyújtástratomány a lényeges, és 0-tól nyugodtan válthatunk azonnal a táblázatban szereplõ gyújtásértékre. Here is a log file, you can see that the spark retard and the fuel enrichment works good in the 1.17 firmware: [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/log5.xls ALS log] ---- '''One car runs fine with 1.1.8, but the other does not even start''' We must closely examine the config and tables difference between the 2. * There is no RPM signal. * does wheel error keep increasing ? Old 1.0.38 firmware, but the isn't with the new 1.1.8 firmware. Here are the files: * [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/configFeri.txt config] * [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/tablesFeri.txt tables] What files are these ? * The 1.0.38 config that works (with 10C engine) * or the 1.1.8 that works * or the 1.1.8 that does NOT work (with 0C engine) You should '''provide all 3 sets''' so we can compare and give you better hints. * I made trigger logs with the 1.1.8 firmware. I removed all the spark plugs (while capturing triggerlog), so no accelerations and decelerations on the carnk. ** [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/trigger4.bin.txt triggerlog_bin] ** [http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/trigger4.txt triggerlog_txt] If the car runs with 1.0.38, there is no need to change the triggerwheel. We've seen that it's a sloppy wheel. In triggerlog the time ration is often 1.45 instead of 2.0 (remember: this is N-1 wheel) during cranking, but multitooth advanced filter (primary_trigger=09 instead of primary_trigger=01 switches multitooth advanced filter on) set to * 50 .. 125% for normal tooth * 125 .. 300% for missing tooth After it starts, at RPM >500 the RPM variation during 180 crankdeg is not that severe. Normal toothwidth=40, missing toothwidth=80 look good for 36-1 wheel. reset_engphase_after=160 looks good when no camsync is used. * tooth_wheel_twidth1=28 * tooth_wheel_twidth2=50 * reset_engphase_after=A0 ---- '''Ignition outputs''' You are using 2 different set of reftooth => ignout mapping. This fires ignch2 after reftooth 0: * h[1]=00 12 00 12 00 12 00 12 * h[2]=20 30 20 30 20 30 20 30 This fires ignch2 after reftooth 18: * h[1]=12 00 12 00 12 00 12 00 * h[2]=20 30 20 30 20 30 20 30 That is 180 degrees difference. '''Clearly, only one can be good'''. This is the most likely reason for one engine not willing to start ---- '''Injector outputs''' Please elaborate on injector wiring and sequence. '''If''' * firing sequence is cyl 1,3,4,2 * and wiring is "straight" cyl 1..4 wired to injector output A..D, than any (of the 4 possible) rotation of 01,04,08,02 mask-sequence (remember to read from bottom to top, in MegaTune) is good: * h[0]=01 02 08 04 .. .. .. .. Note that this does not effect RPM=0, and even does not prevent the car from starting. But verify and confirm to prevent one cylinder leaning out in some conditions. ---- '''Other''' 3 degrees of cranking advance is extremely low (6..10 is more common), if the base timing is set correctly * ign_crank_advance=0C --------- '''News:''' Because the RPM=0 problem, we thought to change the triggerwheel. It does not seems good too. It was rusty, and not harmness. So we chenged the wheel, also we'll use a HALL cranksensor insted of VR. http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/HALL_LAncia.jpg The missing tooth is about 90 crankdegrees BTDC. The trigger settings for this 12-1 wheel, with the new firmware(1.1.11) (GenBoard/UnderDevelopment/FirmwareChanges) *primary_trigger=01 # multitooth without advanced filter *secondary_trigger=02 # disabled *tooth_wheel=0B # decimal 11 tooth *trigger_tooth=01 # *ign_tdcdelay=78 # 60 crankdegrees *another_trigger_tooth=06 *tooth_wheel_twidth2=78 # 120 means 30deg *tooth_wheel_twidth1=F0 # 240 means 60deg *reset_engphase_after=A0 # no camsync If ignch2 and ignch3 are used, in a wasted spark way: * h[2]=20 30 20 30 .. .. .. .. * h[1]=00 06 00 06 .. .. .. .. Change to * h[1]=06 00 06 00 .. .. .. .. if you connected ignchannels to cyl-pair 1,4 and 2,3 the other way around. (or change h[2]) ----- I'm using 1.1.12 firmware, from here: http://www.vems.hu/files/Firmware/release/v3_firmware_1.1.12_12x12.zip Here is the config files: http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/new/config00.txt http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/new/tables00.txt And here is a short log: http://www.vems.hu/files/Fero/Lancia/new/Lancia00.xls I'm using soft idle ignition cut for idle. The problem is that soft idle ignition cut should be activated only after the time limit is reched, when the ALS switch is turned on!
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